What is the meaning of this Navy insignia?

Question

My reason for asking:&#160; I am trying to build a shadow box for my dad with his decorations and his accurate Navy rate badges. My father was a Fire Controlman 2c (T) during WW2.&#160; This was the highest rating he achieved.&#160; I have this information from his actual Navy personnel file I obtained from the St. Louis archives. We have in the family files some other rate badges that I don't know how they fit into his story.&#160; I have attached some photos of the items I'm trying to understand. 1.&#160;&#160;&#160;&#160; I've been told that the 3 chevrons with the arc across the top means a Chief Petty Officer.&#160; I've also been told that the square-knot rate might have been a rate he was 'awarded' during training at Great Lakes Naval Station in Illinois.&#160; I've been told that these rates didn't really mean anything once he left training and was assigned to his ship (USS Arctic). 2.&#160;&#160;&#160;&#160; Anchor with 2 stars, with USN across the front - is this an actual Navy badge/insignia?&#160; What does it mean, and when would it have been awarded to him? 3.&#160;&#160;&#160;&#160; This is an example of a Fire Controlman rate; this is the rate I KNOW he achieved.&#160; Can you confirm that this is his 1st class rate; his second class rate would have added a second red chevron. Can anybody shed any light on the 'rope' rate badge, and the anchor pin? Thank you very much.

Christian Belena · Answer

Here is another great resource for WWII-era Naval Ratings > USN WW2 Enlisted Ratings

Christian Belena · Answer

I am unsure. My did but I was in from 1987 to 1993 and then from 2000 to

2004. Things have changed over these many years. However, it is apparently

something that was done only during training/boot camp at that particular

time and not something he took with him to the Fleet.

Christian Belena

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Alan Walker · Answer

Ms. Koehn,

Regarding the first image, here is a thread that discusses it: What is the USN rate with a rope knot, ex-apprentice? - NAVY, COAST GUARD AND OTHER SEA SERVICES - U.S. Militaria Forum

The center image is of a standard collar or cap device; it looks to be on the large side,

so it would be a cap device.

The last image is the Fire Controlman, third class insignia. You are correct in that two stripes would denote second class.

Hope this helps!

Douglas Bicknese · Answer

For more information about what practices may have taken place during boot camp, you may want to reach out to the Museum of the American Sailor at Great Lakes Naval Training Center . . . https://www.history.navy.mil/content/history/museums/nmas/explore/collections-and-research/research.html

Derek Grover · Answer

I believe that is the old RCPO "Recruit Chief Petty Officer"insignia. Within any given Recruit Training Company there are "Recruit Leaders" who are chosen by the Company Commanders.&#160; There are usually three or four chosen from the ranks of the recruit company to include one RCPO, one MA "Master At Arms" and two other designates who's names I forget... This is only for Bootcamp and does not carry into active duty...&#160; Hope this helps...

Martha Collins · Answer

One item to note is how often during WWII items of uniform changed, as did things like definitions of medals. Christian Belena's post is an excellent example as it is for 2 time periods.There are many resources to be found, just be careful on the date. This is a link to a WWII and beyond Navy periodical. All Hands Archive Browse to May 1943. Download the PDF. An article starts on page 29 (not screen #, but printed page #) that is fairly comprehensive, although it does not mention the rope icon in your first photo.

Derek Grover · Answer

Cindy, Glad I could verify the other answers you have received.&#160; As far as the "Anchor Collar Device" it is emblematic of the enlisted rank of "Master Chief" in the fleet. The "Anchor" without the "Stars" represents "Chief Petty Officer" the two "Stars" represents "Master Chief" (E-9) . It is also used as the "Collar Device" of the RCPO "Recruit Chief Petty Officer" in bootcamp, so it could be from his Recruit Training Company as well. It wouldn't surprise me if he kept both as reminders when he he transferred to the Fleet. As far as the last "Rating / Rank Badge", here's the explanation of the emblems. The Eagle is called a "CROW" and represents "Petty Officer", the rating insignia below it is "FT, Fire Control Technician", the single stripe, called a "ROCKER" represents 3rd Class Petty Officer (E-4), If his Service Record says he was discharged as a "2nd Class PO" there is a possibility that he was "Recommended for Advancement" upon discharge which is common. You should have a page in his "Service Record" titled "Enlisted Performance Record" that will have a listing of all of his "Performance Evaluations, Advancement Recommendations and Advancement Effective Dates".&#160; I am guessing that he was "Recommended for Advancement" upon his discharge and never purchased the 2nd Class Crow (E-5) to put on a uniform that he would never wear again... Hope this gives you a bit more info to go on... DG

Christian Belena · Answer

Cindy: I am a Navy Vet and have done a great deal of research regarding US Navy uniform traditions. Collar devices and/or cap devices (as they are called) come with the rank. So as a Chief Petty Officer, along with his crow (what we call the arm patch although it is specifically what we call the eagle at the top of the rank), he was given one set of shoulder devices upon his promotion. He would have had to purchased additional devices to cover the amount of uniforms he had (and one or two extras as backups.) These are not an "award" in the way of getting a letter of commendation or campaign medal. It is strictly a rank identifier.

However, what you show in the center picture is actually the device (i can't tell what size it is by the photo) for a Master Chief Petty Officer which is one rank above CPO. A CPO would not have any stars.

Petty Officers 1, 2, and 3 class also had them. They are silver and worn on only certain uniforms. Uniforms have changed a great deal over the years (for good and for bad.) As Martha states, a good set of information is All Hands magazine which has its complete archives available online as downloadable PDFs. You can also contact me if you have any Navy uniform-related questions. I'd be more than happy to help you.

Derek Grover · Answer

You are correct, it is the "Master Chief Collar Device" and would have only been worn while he was RCPO "Recruit Chief Petty Officer" in Bootcamp and not authorized for him to wear in the fleet. Also, the photo you posted of your father, he is wearing the white summer "Cracker Jacks" which are the designated uniform for E-6 (1st Class) and below. The Chief's Uniform is a collared shirt, tie, slacks, much like the Officer's Uniform. This photo gives me a clue as to why you have that loose FT3 Rating / Rank badge (3rd Class FT) the red rocker on Navy Blue. I'll bet the badge that you have came off of his winter uniform (Navy Blue Cracker Jacks). When he was promoted to FT2 (2nd Class) he would have had the ship's tailor remove his old 3rd Class stripes and sew on the new 2nd Class FT2 stripes... I'll bet that one patch you have is his old insignia before he was promoted to FT2 and the stripes in the picture FT2 are still on his old uniform... I think you need to get a FT2 Rating / Rank Insignia to build his shadow box with his correct rate / rank.&#160; You can purchase them online for summer white, or winter blue uniform here US NAVY RATING BADGES Bear in mind, the Petty Officer insignia only comes pre-made with 1st Class (3 stripes). You have to cut the lower stripe off and hem the edge of the Insignia with just the remaining 2 rockers (2nd Class). That's why the FT3 Insignia you have has been cut at the bottom edge because they all start-off with 3 stripes and are cut accordingly before they are sewn to the uniform...&#160; http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/80861-my-post-ww2-crows/

Christian Belena · Answer

Your father would not have been authorized to wear the CPO device (pin.) As a 2nd Class PO, if he had worn the CPO device, he would have been either considered out of uniform or impersonating a Chief Petty Officer. Depending on if he was sent up to Captain's Mast and how the Master-At-Arms presented the information to the CO. I am sure he would have been allowed to keep it though, as he did with the arm insignia.

What is the meaning of this Navy insignia?

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